Cheb's More Blood

psyren · 2009 Aug 5

With this latest version (1.9.0-beta6.5) I found only one thing missing, the old "Cheb's More Blood" that some of you might remember (from 5-6 years ago?).

I can't find Cheb, or 'The Modelyard' website anymore, but I did find those .DED files on a CD archive. Wondering if they would even work with the new Doomsday, I dropped them into the Snowberry addons folder, and they show up as compatible. Surprisingly, they run, mostly.

The original effect was a big spray of blood, then leftovers on the floor and walls. 'Short' or 'Long' versions determined how long the pool/splash remained, (with a warning from Cheb that the long version could {obviously} cause lagging problems.)

So the nice spray of red-red groovy is working perfectly, but the leftover is sadly lacking. No leftover at all with the short version. The long version shows, but fades out in about half of a second.

Reading the wiki, I can see that the Header is version 5, but below that I am completely lost as to what does what. Could someone please point me to a more thorough tutorial?

I want to know how to fix it, maybe improve it with better particle effects than were available at the time. Wishing somebody else to do the work will never be as effective as doing it yourself, but I am not a coder and have no idea what I am looking at in the .DED files.

7 year old files here: http://numerometria.com/Doom/ChebsMoreBlood.rar (3KB)

Edit:

"ExamDiff" shows the only differences between 'Long' and 'Short' begin at line 51

Short = lines 51-62




Model {
  State = "BLOOD1";
  Md2{};




}
Model {
  State = "BLOOD2";
  Md2{};


}
Model {
  State = "BLOOD3";
  Md2{};




























}

Long = lines 51-99

Header { Version = 5; }


Model {
  State = "BLOOD3";
  Scale = 2.0;
  Offset = 2;
  Md2{
    File = "decor/blood/tinyblood.md2";
    Frame = "Zero";};
}

Copy Model {
  State = "SMALLPOOL";
  Md2{
    Frame = "Frame 1";};
}

State {
  ID = "BLOOD3";
  Sprite = "BLUD";
  Frame = 0;
  Tics = 105;
  Next state = "SMALLPOOL";
}

Thing {
  ID = "BLOOD";
  DoomEd number = -1;
  Spawn state = "BLOOD1";
  See state = "NULL";
  Pain state = "NULL";
  Melee state = "NULL";
  Missile state = "NULL";
  Death state = "NULL";
  Xdeath state = "NULL";
  Raise state = "NULL";
  See sound = "None";
  Attack sound = "None";
  Pain sound = "None";
  Death sound = "None";
  Active sound = "None";
  Reaction time = 8;
  Spawn health = 1000;
  Radius = 0;
  Height = 16;
  Mass = 100;
  Flags = "mf_noblockmap mf_viewalign";
}

So is this calling models or sprites that do not exist? IE: "decor/blood/tinyblood.md2" and "SMALLPOOL"

Psychikon · 2009 Aug 5

The reason there's no after effect is because it's only the DED. If you look at the "long" version, you'll notice that, for the 3rd frame of the blood, it defines an MD2 model for the blood itself, with frame "zero" (the name of it, obviously because it's the 0th frame, but MD2s you define the names when you make them), and the offset (Y offset, up and down - in this case up) by 2, and also scales it larger by 2; for the blood pool, it copies the previous model, but switches the frame to "frame 1". The last part is a thing definition for the blood, and I'm not sure what that's all about. There are of course already definitions by default, but I'm GUESSING (as I don't know the original ones for the blood) that perhaps it's the flags that are changed in this definition. It probably helps with the model somehow.

psyren · 2009 Aug 5

Thanks Psychikon.

I found the original 'Md2\JDoom\Decor\blood' folder with SmoothBLOOD.png and tinyblood.MD2 in it, so I think I have all the files.

Adding 'Decor\blood' to 'Doomsday\data\jdoom' didn't work. (as if it could be that easy...)

Seems I need to use "md2tool" to convert the .Md2 into DMD, then rewrite the .DED file to point to the new location (?). I can't figure out if both need to be repackaged into a new format somehow, or just where they should go. Might need to convert the .png to .pcx as well (?).

Afraid I'm out of my league here without more reading material.

Psychikon · 2009 Aug 5

It shouldn't necessarily HAVE to be in DMD format. Maybe do a few steps to ensure that everything is set up properly. Since it's older and worked with kickstart, make sure that the DED is pointing to a folder that not only the MD2 is in, but that is recognized already. It can still be in its own, separate pk3. The thing with being in a separate pk3 is that it's also easy for you to manage which ones come first. Being that the folder or whatever might be dependent (???) upon other DEDs or folders with jDRP or something, make sure that you put that package last in loading order. Right-click on the addons tab's addon selection window, then go to "load order..."

If that doesn't work, send me the link and I'll fix it and repost it elsewhere or something like that.

psyren · 2009 Aug 5

Thank you again, Psychikon, but I am not understanding this.

Reading more at DEW, about DED Material, and finding almost no similarity between version 5 and version 6.

Thinking I might learn something by examining a new .DED file, I downloaded the 'jdrp v1.1 alpha', unpacked 'BloodSplat.PK3' by Dani J, and now I am even more lost than before.

Header { Version = 6 }

# -----------------------------------------------
# -                   Misc FX                   - by Dani J
# -----------------------------------------------
#------------------------------------------------------------------

#------------------------------------------------------------------
# Blood Spray

Model {  State = "BLOOD1"  Md2{}}
Copy Model{ State = "BLOOD2"}
Copy Model{ State = "BLOOD3"}

Generator {
  State = "BLOOD1"
  Flags = blendrsub | srcvel | spawn
  Speed = 1.5
  Speed rnd = .9
  Spawn age = 1
  Max age = 60
  Particles = 30
  Spawn rate = 30
  Spawn Rnd = .4
  Vector { 0 0 0 }
  Vector rnd = 1
  Alt start = 6
  Alt Rnd = .025
  Stage {
    	Type = "pt_point"
    	Tics = 25
    	Rnd = .5
    	Radius = .3
    	Bounce = 0.3
    	Resistance = .04
    	Gravity = 0.1
    	Color { 0 1 1 1 }
  	}
  Stage {
    	Type = "pt_point"
    	Tics = 15
    	Rnd = .5
    	Radius = .25
    	Bounce = .3
    	Resistance = .06
    	Gravity = .2
    	Color { 0 1 1 1 }
  	}
  Stage {
    	Type = "pt_point"
    	Tics = 7
    	Radius = .2
    	Bounce = .3
    	Resistance = .1
    	Gravity = .
    	Color { 0 1 1 .5 }
  	}
  Stage {
    	Type = "pt_point"
    	Tics = 3
    	Radius = .2
    	Bounce = .3
    	Resistance = .1
    	Gravity = .3
    	Radius = 1
    	Color { 0 .1 .1 .01 }
  	}
  Stage {
    	Type = "pt_point"
    	Radius = .01
  	}
  Stage {
    	Type = "pt_point"
	Tics = 100
    	Radius = .01
  	}
  Stage { 
	Type = "pt_tex06"
	Tics = 1
	Radius = .1
	Bounce = .3
	Resistance = .05
	Gravity = 0
	Color { 0 1 1 0 }
	}
  Stage {
	Type = "pt_tex06"
	Tics = 3
	Radius = 3
	Bounce = 0
	Resistance = .1
	Gravity = -.02
	Color { 0 1 1 .6 }
	}
  Stage {
	Type = "pt_tex06"
	Tics = 3
	Radius = 5
	Bounce = 0
	Resistance = .1
	Gravity = -.02
	Color { 0 1 1 .3 }
	}
  Stage {
	Type = "pt_tex06"
	Tics = 20
	Radius = 10
	Bounce = 0
	Resistance = .2
	Gravity = -.02
	Color { 0 1 1 .2 }
	}
  Stage { 
	Type = "pt_tex06"
	Radius = 10
	Color { 0 .5 .5 0 }
	} 
}

So his 'BloodSplat' is using "BLOOD1" Md2 from something, but I see no effect at all when I played using this .DED (?) Probably because it was loaded before jdrp (?)

***

Since the particle effects from Cheb's file are definately working, then what needs to be done is to add the .Md2?

Can I edit the line,

File = "decor/blood/tinyblood.md2";

and change it to

File = "tinyblood.md2";

Then make a .PK3 that includes all three files? IE: 'MoreBlood-long.DED' + 'tinyblood.MD2' + 'SmoothBLOOD.png' ?

No, that didn't work. It was listed as compatible in Snowberry, and in the list below the wad and the jdrp, but there were no effects at all ingame except the jdrp stuff.

Maybe "WinRAR" cannot make a working .PK3 (?) or I just didn't do it right. (my first time trying to create one.) Most likely it is that I do not understand.

I will replace the file in my first post to include Cheb's .Md2 and .png and you can probably figure this out.

Psychikon · 2009 Aug 5

No MD2 is defined in DaniJ's blood splats, because the sprites are being drawn as nothing. This is so that the Generator definition that follows will be the only blood - particles!

The state of animation is BLOOD1 - 3, and the Md2 {} has no "File =" in it to specify an MD2 and so that's why it seemingly has no effect. Notice that it's just particles for blood!

I would imagine that yes, you use jDRP 1.1 alpha AFTER v1.0. That way the old blood particle definitions don't write over these. Looking at it again, it looks as though textures are being used for the last states of the particles after they hit walls and such. This way, it should appear as splatters.

As far as Cheb's mod:
a PK3 (not sure if you knew) is just a .zip folder with NO compression. With winrar, you just use the setting "store" for instance. Otherwise, it won't read it properly! Then you just make sure it's saved with the extension .pk3... Make sure that it's .zip format, too, and that THAT radio button is checked and not the .rar button...
Any models should be in a folder inside the pk3 like this:
Data/jDoom/Models/ etc., so after models in this case Decor/blood/ and that's where you'd put the files. That way, it should read them in properly. When it looks for models, I think it always looks in Data/(whichever game)/Models/ unless otherwise specified.

psyren · 2009 Aug 6

Psychikon wrote:

With winrar, you just use the setting "store" for instance. Otherwise, it won't read it properly! Then you just make sure it's saved with the extension .pk3... Make sure that it's .zip format, too, and that THAT radio button is checked and not the .rar button...

Reading this, I am hopeful that I can do this, (with this help) and not abandon it to the wishlist!

I did not use any "store" setting. I just clicked the folder that everything was in and then "add to archive". I did make sure it was .zip and not .rar, but I didn't make any effort to organise the files in any way. I just changed the extension, save as 'moreblud.zip' to 'moreblud.PK3' and it seemingly made a .PK3 file. (which did nothing)

Psychikon wrote:

Any models should be in a folder inside the pk3 like this:
Data/jDoom/Models/ etc., so after models in this case Decor/blood/ and that's where you'd put the files. That way, it should read them in properly. When it looks for models, I think it always looks in Data/(whichever game)/Models/ unless otherwise specified.

So the .DED file will not read a file with no path the same way an .html file will? I can't just use File = "tinyblood.md2"; and expect it to use it? I need to make a folder for the .Md2 and .png and then add that to the path?

I am assuming that the .Md2 and .png that are in the same folder are related to each other

Sorry for all the dumbass questions, but my skills are limited to coding .html, and even after a DECADE of designing webpages, I can barely write .html without copy/paste! {"DOS for Dummies" cannot even penetrate the depth of my ignorance, or rather my aversion to CODE.}

JonusC · 2009 Aug 6

If you want the original files, Web Archive is there to save the day

http://web.archive.org/web/*/http://mod ... ewdoom.com

The latest one before going offline is May 21, 2007. If the download file doesn't work, try using an earlier Wayback Machine mirror date.

I wonder, what actually happened to ModelYard? The very next Wayback mirror entry after the one above simply states...

...its alive! - DaniJ 06/06/2007

...Does anybody know what happaned? DaniJ?

EDIT: I can't seem to find this "More Blood" mod at the Model Yard. I also tried Cheb's Personal Homepage at http://chebmaster.narod.ru/index_english.html but he doesn't seem to have any Doom-related material whatsoever.

EDIT2: It's the oldest Webarchive miror (was More Blood ever updated?) but apparently the 'More Blood' addon is contained in this particular version of the jDoom Model Pack - http://web.archive.org/web/200310100153 ... _mpack.exe

EDIT3: (Last one I promise!) I could of sworn that the jDRP had an updated/optimized way of the More Blood effect.... :?

psyren · 2009 Aug 6

That's cool, Jonas C, but I am not lacking of the original files.

Back in the USSA, my first computer was a Gateway with a mere Pentium2, 350MHz chip and an ATI card that was powerful enough to run games with minimum specs of 500MHz. I used that machine for almost 6 years, then brought it to Brasil and it died in about 6 months, from salt and power fluctuations (I imagine), but before it died I had the entire HD burned to CDs. (A whopping 12 GB!) If you want an ancient Doom file from 98-04, I probably have it.

The files Cheb made are in the link from my first post in this thread. I only took the .Md2 and .png out of the original folders because, even with Psychikon's help, I couldn't get them to work. They are right out of my old "C:\Doomsday" folder, but I probably have the downloads saved as well. As a compulsive collector, I downloaded everything at that time, and I think they were all separate. I'll look. Interested in anything in particular? BFG effects? Fireballs? Rocket smoke trails? The first Doom64TC?

I only started this thread because I'm in love with JDoom again and thought I could make an easy fix for Cheb's More Blood. I'd have posted it in the "addons in progress" section if I thought it would be so much work.

PS. JonasC, do you want to rebuild the Modelyard? I have about 20MB of space on the Indian server that hosts my website.

Psychikon · 2009 Aug 6

I just realized a potential problem. I'm not sure how to set it up to where you would make a selection of two DEDs inside of a particular PK3, and you'd have to add them either/or with the additional PK3 for the graphical part always selected either way... That's not really THAT much of a problem I think, except that you know, it's like "why?" I'm just not completely familiar with all of Snowberry's features, so I couldn't tell you how that works or completely how the .box format works with titles and versions etc. All I know is that the items in the jXRP that are "version 1.1" and are the same thing as version 1.0 of the jHeretic models, it makes them null and void, or it did a few releases ago.

EDIT: What I mean is that, if you have both DED files in the .PK3, it will just read through them sequentially I think, so that the one read last will overwrite the one read first, making it appear as though the one you prefer might never work.

Here, I've uploaded a proper PK3 in the way that it should be set up according to the definitions:

http://www.fileden.com/files/2007/4/22/1007617/ChebsMoreBlood.pk3

You can explore it to see how I set it up if you'd like.

Psychikon · 2009 Aug 6

psyren wrote:

As a compulsive collector, I downloaded everything at that time, and I think they were all separate. I'll look. Interested in anything in particular? BFG effects? Fireballs? Rocket smoke trails? The first Doom64TC?

Hey, you know the BFG effects? Wasn't there a texture particle-based explosion effect that kind of fell by the wayside? It would be really simple to re-do, just that I'm wondering where it came from. I was thinking Abbs pack, but then I could've sworn I remember it being used by the regular BFG model.

psyren · 2009 Aug 6

Sorry, Psychikon,
That didn't work any more than the .PK3 I tried to make. Snowberry isn't reading the .DED at all unless it is in the 'addons' folder by itself.

I think it's a bug. Cheb's original .DED file works, for particle effects, whether it is first or last in install order, but I tried making a .PK3 of it, (by itself, so no possibility of file organisation error,) and it doesn't work.

This would also explain why I see no effects from the jdrp 1.1 files (.PK3's) that I tried.

Can anyone confirm this? Believe me, you'll notice as soon as you hit an enemy (or you get hit yourself) if you have Cheb's .DED active, long or short.

6.5 is a beta with bugs. Music volume isn't working properly, and I can live with that. It would be nice if someone else could confirm that it will not load .PK3's, (Dani J?) and we can stop wasting our time. (Or try another format, like a .BOX maybe?)

Psychikon,
So far I have only found an old 'jdoom_mpack' and 'jdoom_resource_pack_1' but both are in the same folder as 'deng-inst-1.7.15-1'. I know I have more somewhere, but a lot of CDs to look into. Found 'Abbspack-V2' and 'deng-inst-1.7.14' now, and thinking maybe all those mods were not separate after all.

No idea what BFG mod you are wondering about, or if I ever used it. This Collector is also a miser. Save my energy cells for when I really need them, and then always finishing a battle without. I only used the BFG on Makron in Q2. Correction, I used it as soon as I picked it up in Doom64. BShoom! and it only killed 2 of the 4 Mancubi that had me trapped in a corner.

Abbs isn't so impossible to find, or difficult to communicate with. I was in contact with him about Risen before the Deng Team got my JDoom fixed, and he has no idea what happened to Cheb either. He may be able to answer your BFG question though.

Psychikon · 2009 Aug 6

Wow, that's really weird. It works fine for me... I don't know what to tell you about it, then.

I'm sorry

EDIT: Don't worry about the BFG effects, I was just wondering. Like I said, it was something very easy to re-create. It's just something that was in the back of my mind, that's all...

JonusC · 2009 Aug 7

psyren wrote:

...and it died in about 6 months, from salt and power fluctuations (I imagine)

I know the feeling, I live on the East Coast of Australia (about 5 mins from the Beach). The worst thing is how the dust that gathers in fans is brown/orange and salt-sticky, in my lifetime of various PC's i've had about five PSU's explode :S

psyren wrote:

If you want an ancient Doom file from 98-04, I probably have it.

I'll keep that in mind (friend request sent) I plan to convert many MegaWads of past into Doomsday-compatible packages, there are probably quite a few that doomworld/idgames doesnt have archived.

psyren wrote:

Interested in anything in particular? BFG effects? Fireballs? Rocket smoke trails? The first Doom64TC?

Maybe

it depends as I am also somewhat of a collector/archiver/hoarder myself (many DVD's of backups stashed in closets) but I plan to go through my own material and catalogue it - when I do that i'll start looking for things I don't have.

psyren wrote:

PS. JonasC, do you want to rebuild the Modelyard? I have about 20MB of space on the Indian server that hosts my website.

Why is it that you're asking me if i'd like to help rebuild it....? I'm a nobody

) And thats good to know but I have a Shared Webhost account (soon to go dedicated) with hundreds of gigs and "unlimited" bandwidth (as my provider claims)

Psychikon wrote:

I'm not sure how to set it up to where you would make a selection of two DEDs inside of a particular PK3

I believe you would have to make a .box format addon for Snowberry to allow a choice of what DED/DEH/WAD/PK3/whatever to load instead of all.

psyren wrote:

Music volume isn't working properly

This has been a bug ever since the original beta of Deng 1.9.0 AFAIK, and there are many many many other software emulators/interpreters/sourceports out there with a similar bug. It's to do with changes in Windows Vista MCI and DirectX changes, DirectMusic support was obsoleted by... XAUDIO or something with an X in it... and the MIDI control of it is retarded and not quite backwards compatible. My point is that Windows Vista had changed the model used for MIDI playback and broke a lot of existing things. It's a known bug though so don't worry.

Yeah I don't know why you can't get DED files to work at all :-/ Putting them into .\MyAddon.PK3\Defs\jDoom\Auto\Definition.ded should work fine (if you put them in the ROOT of the PK3 I *think* you have to point to them via a meta file or something, it's been a while since I did anything like this but I'll be getting into it again soon)

psyren · 2009 Aug 14

I haven't been back to check this thread so I apologise for the late response. No idea what I am doing wrong that Psychikon's .PK3 isn't working for me, and I ain't gonna bother with it.

@ JonasC. Reading every other thread and topic in this forum that looks interesting, I see you are working on quite a bit. Other than Doom64, I can't say that I ever played any wad (much less a megawad) that was specifically designed for JDoom, so I don't know what that's all about, but I do hope you can get some of these old mods working again.

JonasC wrote:

Why is it that you're asking me if i'd like to help rebuild it....? I'm a nobody

Well I know Kaiser, and know of Skyjake, DaniJ, Kurikai. They are Gods walking among us. We play and spend our time in the worlds they make real, and they sometimes come to talk with us when we have questions. I guess I feel comfortable with the Gods as long as they speak my language. (I think I said nearly the same thing to Abbs, and that he needs a dedicated forum to get Risen3D more known, developed, and appreciated.) You are working with things I am not familiar to even play with, so I thought of you as at least a demi-god. Not a nobody.

I love this latest version, and the music problem doesn't bother me, (as long as the eventual fix is not something that only works for Vista/7 and makes my XP obsolete! I'll be praying for a new Risen then, or {GOD FORBID!} a new GZDoom.)

And yes, I know those brown/orange spots on my USB ports and on all the tinned metal on the back of the PC. I thought tin was supposed to stop iron/steel from corroding, but I guess my metallurgical knowledge was lacking. East coast of Oz must be similar to Rio de Janeiro.

Funny, or maybe not, and entirely irrelevant. I used to be in Salem Oregon, USA, an hour away from the blue Pacific. Atlantic ocean of USA is so dark and polluted. Go to the beach in New Jersey or Delaware and it looks like mud. Only Jellyfish live in it. In Brasil it is only green. Not blue like the Pacific. I lived 2 blocks from the beach in Ipanema where my Gateway bit the salt, but now I am 5 miles inland, and I'm sure it's a bit safer for my machine.

You know? Somebody invented WD-40. Somebody invented those little moisture absorbing silicon pellets. Something that takes salt out of the air could be a million dollar invention!

Well, I think I will just go watch "Woodstock" and contemplate what we have lost and what we have gained in the past 40 years.

JonusC · 2009 Aug 14

psyren wrote:

@ JonasC. Reading every other thread and topic in this forum that looks interesting, I see you are working on quite a bit. Other than Doom64, I can't say that I ever played any wad (much less a megawad) that was specifically designed for JDoom, so I don't know what that's all about, but I do hope you can get some of these old mods working again.

'Working on quite a bit' might be a little bit of an over-statement as I don't have a lot of spare time, but I do have ideas and things i'd like to check out. Well a MegaWad is just a nickname for a WAD that contains an entire epic of levels, sometimes with custom badguys or weapons or graphics (but not always), with the idea that it's a "new episode" or new story to play. Doom II - The Master Levels is an example of an official MegaWad, I suppose Final Doom could technically be a MegaWad of Doom II aswell (although not really as they are standalone games).

My plans to "convert" these older mods to jDoom isn't much more than re-packaging them - if there is a DEHacked file i'll try and put it into DED's and for the mods I really like i'll probably try to enhance then with some Deng-specific features (lighting, particles, etc)

psyren wrote:

Well I know Kaiser, and know of Skyjake, DaniJ, Kurikai. They are Gods walking among us. We play and spend our time in the worlds they make real, and they sometimes come to talk with us when we have questions. I guess I feel comfortable with the Gods as long as they speak my language. (I think I said nearly the same thing to Abbs, and that he needs a dedicated forum to get Risen3D more known, developed, and appreciated.) You are working with things I am not familiar to even play with, so I thought of you as at least a demi-god. Not a nobody.

I have to admit i've never tried Risen3D. The screenshots on their frontpage look amazing, particularly the map and the weapons. I have a strange attitude towards forks though... what was the reason for Risen3D apart from Boom/MBF compatibility? Apart from that, It honestly saddens me to see that Risen3D's creator couldnt join the Deng team but decided to split off instead... that's the biggest downside to open source though I guess. Well anyway, i'm quite flattered by your words

but I havn't done anything yet so don't be too hasty to elevate your opinion of a stranger! I don't know too much about software design but would like to learn one day, as it's a goal of mine to see jWolf and jStrife fully functional. Regardless, i'm just trying to find things that I can do and help with to show my appreciation to the Deng team and the Doom community

psyren wrote:

I love this latest version, and the music problem doesn't bother me, (as long as the eventual fix is not something that only works for Vista/7 and makes my XP obsolete! I'll be praying for a new Risen then, or {GOD FORBID!} a new GZDoom.)

I'm sure the SDL_mixer or, if it ends up being implemented, FMOD, will remain 100% backwards compatible with Windows XP

) There's a lot of life left in that OS, enthusiasts will keep it alive for another 10 years at least you'll see (if Win98SE is still alive today, XP surely will last longer).

So you have the MIDI volume problem on XP too? I thought it was a Vista-only issue. Interesting.

psyren wrote:

And yes, I know those brown/orange spots on my USB ports and on all the tinned metal on the back of the PC. I thought tin was supposed to stop iron/steel from corroding, but I guess my metallurgical knowledge was lacking.

Tin is designed to be an anti-oxidant and strengthening additive, yes, but when it comes down to it any metal with Iron in it can rust its just a matter of how quickly. Salt and moisture is known to greatly accelerate the chemical reaction of Iron and Oxygen (Oxidisation/Oxidization, a.k.a. "Rusting") and even some of my stainless-steel cutlery has oxygen spots. Oh and the more "green" there is in the rust spots is a good indication of how much Iron content there is (very very green = mostly iron). I only know this because I grew up on a farm, and as a kid there sometimes the best fun was following the the father around while he worked and asking random questions :P

psyren wrote:

East coast of Oz must be similar to Rio de Janeiro.

I have a few "Facebook pals" from thart corner of the world and judging from the photo's it seems to be. But Australia is dry and our trees are skinny

psyren wrote:

Funny, or maybe not, and entirely irrelevant. I used to be in Salem Oregon, USA, an hour away from the blue Pacific. Atlantic ocean of USA is so dark and polluted. Go to the beach in New Jersey or Delaware and it looks like mud. Only Jellyfish live in it. In Brasil it is only green. Not blue like the Pacific. I lived 2 blocks from the beach in Ipanema where my Gateway bit the salt, but now I am 5 miles inland, and I'm sure it's a bit safer for my machine.

USA beaches are pretty horrible, although one of my life goals is to spend a week in Florida Keys! Here's a photo of the beach close to where I live (during summer of course) - http://outdoors.webshots.com/photo/1112 ... 2455mhkacI

psyren wrote:

You know? Somebody invented WD-40. Somebody invented those little moisture absorbing silicon pellets. Something that takes salt out of the air could be a million dollar invention! Well, I think I will just go watch "Woodstock" and contemplate what we have lost and what we have gained in the past 40 years.

I think there are Air Purifiers that can remove extra-salt

but they are expensive, somewhat inefficient and require constant maintenance from memory (we had one before). Right on, you have fun

EDIT: I'll probably take a look at this More Blood addon soon and see what I can figure out

Cheb's More Blood

Comments