Please submit a bug report and either attach your map to it, or include a link to somewhere I can download it, or pm/email me if you don't want to make it public.
I don't think the Block Sound lines are at fault here. I made a map with Block Sound lines and it worked fine under Doomsday Beta 6.7. Remember, you need to have two Block Sound lines in between you and the monsters, not one.
The problem I found was that when you shot the switch and opened the door revealing all of the Imps, the entire room opened like a door. I decided to edit the map and add a sector in between the starting platform and the door that opened and had that act as a door. The Imps did not spot me that way.
So instead of having the entire room open as a door, just create a separate, much smaller surrounding sector to open as the door that the Imps cannot see you through.
Here is an image of what I added, with the highlighted orange sector being the door that I added, separating you from the Imps.
Sorry sonic? that is not what the problem is, you are trying to fix a bug that the engine has and anyone could make a work around but that is not the correct way of going about it. I see you act before you think, are you planning on fixing all wads in the same scenario since 1996 so they will all work with beta6.7? I didn't think so.
As I said "I'v tested it in zdoom, legacy, prboom and the older DD 1.8.6 aswell and they all work like they should."
6.7 beta isn't, which is why I posted about it here. Not for someone to come along and hack at my map.
There's nothing wrong with the map or the no blocking flag as-is, again you are wrong in think the whole map opens up lmao, that is just 1 big door, nothing more, with a working sound blocking flag, again as I said, I tested it on "zdoom, legacy, prboom and the older DD 1.8.6" and they all do what they should, the problem is in the 6.7 beta currently. All you did was split the door in half.
It looks as if you didn't read my posts, so I repeated myself twice, I hope I got through to you sonic.
The map is copyrighted and you just started hacking at it without even asking, to me that is an even worse problem.
Again, there is nothing wrong with the map: "I'v tested it in zdoom, legacy, prboom and the older DD 1.8.6 aswell and they all work like they should." Maybe you should do the same.
I'll wait for Dani's reply, the development team is who this was directed to in the first place.
I didn't save the edited version FYI and have no intent of calling it my work or anything, sorry for the miscommunication....I just like to trial and error a lot of stuff...
Didn't you say your problem was that some of the Imps make their awakening noise at the start of the map? You're right, I didn't notice that in the other ports, but I don't think it's the Block Sound line issue....as I said, I created a test map with Block Sound lines and the monsters did not react to the gunfire. Even though the ceiling where the Imps are is brought all the way down to the floor height, the Imps should not see you or react to sound until it is opened... I should give this a test in Chocolate Doom, which is as vanilla as they come, and I'll get back to you...
Also, it appears all of your Imps are flagged as "Deaf", and that's what is keeping them from not reacting, not the Block Sound lines. When it comes to Block Sound lines, the sound "travels" from sector to sector until it gets caved in completely in between Block Sound lines.
And you're crushing all of the poor little Imps who can't breathe until the door is opened! lol...
EDIT: I tested under Chocolate Doom....and the Imps weren't awakened before the door is opened, so yeah, it is Doomsday must not like something, but I don't know what it is. And when I did test it in Chocolate Doom, I wanna let you know that the room that you start out in screws up the floor and the ceiling......it looks like a colored sprinkles wonderland!
Heh, yes I know they are smushed inside the wall, but that is fine as long as it works like it should.
It's usually not the way I do things and the monsters and no block was actually temporary as it is a DM map and I set the switch and imps up for kicks when playtesting.
Never the less, I found that there was an issue there with 6.7 and thought I'd post about it because it may have went un-noticed for a while. And what good a time than any to post about it.
Edit: Most likely from the tall sky. It's limit removing and most all ports support things like that without any real compatibility issues.
For Mega5 though, I'll most likely set some standards for the sky and midi music.
I don't know what would cause it either, so the only thing I can do is assume it could have to do with the no blocking flag or spawn sound awakening the monsters somehow, currently hard to say.
But I do know fact, it's something to do with 6.7.
I found out what is causing the sprinkles problem in Chocolate Doom on your floor (FLAT622) that you added. Did you use XWE to add the floor? If you rename the FF_END to F_END, it should get rid of the sprinkles floor and please Chocolate Doom.
It's probably a vision bug from the Imps in Doomsday, not a sound-activated issue.
Yeah actaully I did, I ripped it out of the mega pretty quick to post it on here as a pre-release map for testing with the beta 6.7 issue.
~ wasn't to worried about what choclolate-doom had to say about it for the above reason heh, I know it will run in Doom2.exe without the sky. ~ however it may crash due to vpo of course.
As you do, I assum it could be more than just a sound flag issue.
It could be a number of things and there's no use in guessing heh.
Oh, ok. I'm that kind of person that needs my WAD to be compatbile with everything, and yes, that includes the hideous DOOM95.
What I like to do is play through one of my favorite maps that I created under each Doomsday release, and most of the time, I pick up at least one bug. This is how I picked up the gunfire switches not working with the last release, and I've found other things in my map that previous versions of Doomsday did not work with.
But let's see what DaniJ or skyjake's explanation on this map is, our side-chat aside.
Right, and same here, that's what Mega5 is about but I didn't take much interest in chocolate-doom for this test release. Sorry to sound kind of offensive at first but I wanted to make it clear that it's not the maps fault when it runs perfectly on everything else heh. For example, Doom2 wouldn't have a problem with it. and a lump marker isn't what this is about. so yeah, our chat still left us at the same question, although we know the answer is in 6.7 somewhere heh. I'll post this again so Dani wont have to do much looking:
Ok sounds good, I'll check back every few days and see what you found out.
In short, the wad does what it should in all other sourceports ~ including 1.8.6, the imps (are not awakened) when you spawn in the map.
The problem is however, the imps (are awakened) when you spawn in the map in beta6.7.
On a side note, I never had plans of leaving the monsters in the map, it's a DM level, they were just for kicks. And the big door that opens when you shoot the switch will not be there later in the mega either, that area will be open and the switch will be gone. And I'll tell you now, making a big funky door like that actually took a few to make, and have it look ok" when it opened heh.
Not sure if it's exactly the same bug, but I've seen something similar when playing the DOOM2 IWAD.
The best example is in Map 08. The room behind the yellow key door has lots of imps hiding in the walls, who shouldn't activate until you pick up the red key and the walls open. But in beta 6.7 they wake up as soon as I walk into the room. This happens even if I've never fired a shot. I can also hear the imps shooting at me, though their fireballs don't make it through the wall. Interestingly, there are also two barons in that area who DON'T wake up when the imps do.
I've seen similar behavior in other maps where the monsters are in neighboring sectors to the player, separated by one linedef, where the relative floor and ceiling heights should hide the player from the monsters. Level 27, near the blue key door, where the revenants and barons/hell knights are hiding in the ceiling, is another example.
Ah nice!
I wonder what is in question though.
Do the thing types work exactly as they do in Doom?
Do they currently feature a Hexen data type?
here's the funny ones:
Do they sport some new radius athorium heh
Could it be the sprite color inherited to dynamic lighting code somehow awakening the imps? ~ if so, does that mean they have ESP in DDE?
Are the imps running on a higher memory block than the player model? ~the imps don
That is a common DOOM software rendering artefact due to mathematical inaccuracy yes. I'm not overly familiar with vanilla DOOM these days but AFAIK, no it is not possible for that issue to affect whether two things can see each other.
The problem in our case is much more straight forward; a test case not being handled in the line of sight algorithm (back sector floor above front ceiling/back sector ceiling below front floor).
Here's something that's a bit off-topic but something that might interest you as it is still a technical issue.
Has to do with a map I made of a motherboard: http://img180.imageshack.us/img180/9371/doom2009.png
The problem is, video lagg with this map, only in DE though.
Other sourceports run the map fine though, even legacy.
My system specs: Intel Core 2 Duo e8400 @ 3ghz per core, Gigabyte ep43-udl, 2gb corsair pc6400 dual, pci-e geforce 8400 gs 512mb, 500gb WD sata hdd, windows xp pro sp3.
video drivers and dx fully up to date.
No I dont like my video card much but that shouldn't be the problem here heh.
I think it has something to do with the amount of segs in a given view plane?
I disabled the radio shadowing, but it didnt make a differece.
If it's not a known issue, I'll pm you the map.
We are aware of the present performance issues yes. The poor performance is primarily caused by a handful of known bottlenecks in several key areas. As you know, we are currently in the process of a major architectural overhaul and presently, not all of the required systems and mechanisms have been implemented. This means that in order to continue making regular public releases we have to work around the currently missing code by implementing metaphorical sticky tape
Once all the components of the new architecture are in place we will then spend time focusing on any performance issues. The current bottlenecks will disappear anyway in due process.
Nice map btw. Please do pm it to me as it looks like a nice test case for profiling.
Heh, metaphorical sticky tape. I could just imagine you guys jogging through code and jumping over parts that are commented out with a big piece of sticky tape on it. :P
But yeah I could only imagine the time it would take to go through all the code and have to make adjustments to skip parts until it's fully implemented. and then having to go back and complete the process. I'm thinking you guys are currently still using the legacy render until the new render is finalized, and the new is currently one of the things that is being skipped until ready?
Comments
The problem I found was that when you shot the switch and opened the door revealing all of the Imps, the entire room opened like a door. I decided to edit the map and add a sector in between the starting platform and the door that opened and had that act as a door. The Imps did not spot me that way.
So instead of having the entire room open as a door, just create a separate, much smaller surrounding sector to open as the door that the Imps cannot see you through.
Here is an image of what I added, with the highlighted orange sector being the door that I added, separating you from the Imps.
As I said "I'v tested it in zdoom, legacy, prboom and the older DD 1.8.6 aswell and they all work like they should."
6.7 beta isn't, which is why I posted about it here. Not for someone to come along and hack at my map.
There's nothing wrong with the map or the no blocking flag as-is, again you are wrong in think the whole map opens up lmao, that is just 1 big door, nothing more, with a working sound blocking flag, again as I said, I tested it on "zdoom, legacy, prboom and the older DD 1.8.6" and they all do what they should, the problem is in the 6.7 beta currently. All you did was split the door in half.
It looks as if you didn't read my posts, so I repeated myself twice, I hope I got through to you sonic.
The map is copyrighted and you just started hacking at it without even asking, to me that is an even worse problem.
Again, there is nothing wrong with the map: "I'v tested it in zdoom, legacy, prboom and the older DD 1.8.6 aswell and they all work like they should." Maybe you should do the same.
I'll wait for Dani's reply, the development team is who this was directed to in the first place.
Didn't you say your problem was that some of the Imps make their awakening noise at the start of the map? You're right, I didn't notice that in the other ports, but I don't think it's the Block Sound line issue....as I said, I created a test map with Block Sound lines and the monsters did not react to the gunfire. Even though the ceiling where the Imps are is brought all the way down to the floor height, the Imps should not see you or react to sound until it is opened... I should give this a test in Chocolate Doom, which is as vanilla as they come, and I'll get back to you...
Also, it appears all of your Imps are flagged as "Deaf", and that's what is keeping them from not reacting, not the Block Sound lines. When it comes to Block Sound lines, the sound "travels" from sector to sector until it gets caved in completely in between Block Sound lines.
And you're crushing all of the poor little Imps who can't breathe until the door is opened! lol...
EDIT: I tested under Chocolate Doom....and the Imps weren't awakened before the door is opened, so yeah, it is Doomsday must not like something, but I don't know what it is. And when I did test it in Chocolate Doom, I wanna let you know that the room that you start out in screws up the floor and the ceiling......it looks like a colored sprinkles wonderland!
It's usually not the way I do things and the monsters and no block was actually temporary as it is a DM map and I set the switch and imps up for kicks when playtesting.
Never the less, I found that there was an issue there with 6.7 and thought I'd post about it because it may have went un-noticed for a while. And what good a time than any to post about it.
Edit: Most likely from the tall sky. It's limit removing and most all ports support things like that without any real compatibility issues.
For Mega5 though, I'll most likely set some standards for the sky and midi music.
I don't know what would cause it either, so the only thing I can do is assume it could have to do with the no blocking flag or spawn sound awakening the monsters somehow, currently hard to say.
But I do know fact, it's something to do with 6.7.
It's probably a vision bug from the Imps in Doomsday, not a sound-activated issue.
~ wasn't to worried about what choclolate-doom had to say about it for the above reason heh, I know it will run in Doom2.exe without the sky. ~ however it may crash due to vpo of course.
As you do, I assum it could be more than just a sound flag issue.
It could be a number of things and there's no use in guessing heh.
What I like to do is play through one of my favorite maps that I created under each Doomsday release, and most of the time, I pick up at least one bug. This is how I picked up the gunfire switches not working with the last release, and I've found other things in my map that previous versions of Doomsday did not work with.
But let's see what DaniJ or skyjake's explanation on this map is, our side-chat aside.
Here ya go..
I've not yet had chance to look into the problem but I'll update this thread once I have.
In short, the wad does what it should in all other sourceports ~ including 1.8.6, the imps (are not awakened) when you spawn in the map.
The problem is however, the imps (are awakened) when you spawn in the map in beta6.7.
On a side note, I never had plans of leaving the monsters in the map, it's a DM level, they were just for kicks. And the big door that opens when you shoot the switch will not be there later in the mega either, that area will be open and the switch will be gone.
The best example is in Map 08. The room behind the yellow key door has lots of imps hiding in the walls, who shouldn't activate until you pick up the red key and the walls open. But in beta 6.7 they wake up as soon as I walk into the room. This happens even if I've never fired a shot. I can also hear the imps shooting at me, though their fireballs don't make it through the wall. Interestingly, there are also two barons in that area who DON'T wake up when the imps do.
I've seen similar behavior in other maps where the monsters are in neighboring sectors to the player, separated by one linedef, where the relative floor and ceiling heights should hide the player from the monsters. Level 27, near the blue key door, where the revenants and barons/hell knights are hiding in the ceiling, is another example.
I wonder what is in question though.
Do the thing types work exactly as they do in Doom?
Do they currently feature a Hexen data type?
here's the funny ones:
Do they sport some new radius athorium heh
Could it be the sprite color inherited to dynamic lighting code somehow awakening the imps? ~ if so, does that mean they have ESP in DDE?
Are the imps running on a higher memory block than the player model? ~the imps don
The problem in our case is much more straight forward; a test case not being handled in the line of sight algorithm (back sector floor above front ceiling/back sector ceiling below front floor).
Has to do with a map I made of a motherboard: http://img180.imageshack.us/img180/9371/doom2009.png
The problem is, video lagg with this map, only in DE though.
Other sourceports run the map fine though, even legacy.
My system specs: Intel Core 2 Duo e8400 @ 3ghz per core, Gigabyte ep43-udl, 2gb corsair pc6400 dual, pci-e geforce 8400 gs 512mb, 500gb WD sata hdd, windows xp pro sp3.
video drivers and dx fully up to date.
No I dont like my video card much but that shouldn't be the problem here heh.
I think it has something to do with the amount of segs in a given view plane?
I disabled the radio shadowing, but it didnt make a differece.
If it's not a known issue, I'll pm you the map.
Once all the components of the new architecture are in place we will then spend time focusing on any performance issues. The current bottlenecks will disappear anyway in due process.
Nice map btw. Please do pm it to me as it looks like a nice test case for profiling.
But yeah I could only imagine the time it would take to go through all the code and have to make adjustments to skip parts until it's fully implemented. and then having to go back and complete the process. I'm thinking you guys are currently still using the legacy render until the new render is finalized, and the new is currently one of the things that is being skipped until ready?
PM sent.